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Hi Pyro, love your videos my guy, keep up the great work!
It's to absolutely edge yourself on WarCraft Lore. lmfao
Same. This is the sort of thing that frustrated the hell out of me during my WoW days. I wanted to care, and the VA generally does a great job with the material they're given, but that material often is so disjointed and out of sequence. It should be building up the story, but WoW seems hung up on everything being a big shock moment. Good story telling doesn't have to be about shocking you with plot twists–hell, you can see it coming a mile away and if the story leading up to said twist is well-told, it still feels satisfying.
The really sad irony is, because the story leading up to the big moments isn't told well the big moments end up drifting away like a fart in the wind. None of it feels earned.
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Well atleast Danuser is gone, sad he had to take sylvanas with him 😛
Korta was released before the raid its nt blizzards. Foult u dident do the quests directly
Always loved your videos and admired your love of the story and universe. That being said, I think you acknowledge that you could definitely get out of pocket at times and it's great that you've learned from it. Even though I no longer play the game, I'm glad you're back doing WoW content again.
Love the video and generally your thoughts, perspective.
Btw the story of SL was (is) also not well liked because the game at the time also kind of sucked (9.1). When you have both parts (story, gameplay) wrong..that the effect multiply.
The DF on the other hand hand have MUCH better gameplay and medium story. -> players are not that much fighting against the lore now.
But both xpacs missed in some direction, that have those two in common.
Let's hope saga will have all done well.
Same situation as typical trope where the “villain” turned out to have normal motivations, but we just got it all wrong (Are we the baddies?!?😂)
As an example – Illidan in WoW Burning Crusade VS same timeline, but from WoW Legion perspective.
And yeah, those who thought Sylvanas was a one-sided character could really be surprised by that in-game scene. But for me – it's obvious and nothing new (everything was shown about her stuggles/mind of tactic back in Warcraft III). I don't see/feel any difference if we rearrange those scenes
4:24 lmao
sylvanas is just a shit char for the bodypillow bois or the women who are like "i was wronged and epic" also. only reasonable outcome to sylvanas storyline ending shouldve been offscreen death to a mawrat. so i dislike your sylvanas take.
more on the topic of the video: havent they said multiple times that in wow its gameplay first then the lore? main reason for the everlasting conflict between horde and alliance because otherwize pvp doesnt make sense, but lorewize the threats are so big that fighting among ourselves doesnt make sense. even tho its died down since pvp isnt as big anymore(x-faction guilds, raiding, m+, mercanary pvp mode). so in this case raid first lore after?
I’m an aspiring writer. OVERALL all things considered Warcraft is my favorite fantasy universe. I am painfully aware of how fucking terrible that sounds as an implication of how awful my writing must be I know lol. I’ve experienced much better stories, but Warcraft does have good bones. And to me learning over these years being inspired by something heavily flawed that you understand the criticisms for really is not the worst thing.
Idk if I can ever nail those FFXIV highs my peanut brain too small for that but this is kind of my happy place and seeing fewer people hate it recently if only slightly means a lot to me. I want to learn from Warcraft and the other flawed things I love and Pyro does a lot to help with that.
looks like this is what happens when change the whole story of an expansion right before it launches. You get weird lore moments and dialog that doesnt link well.
Off topic, but I was in the Vale of Eternal Blossoms today and killed a few Black Empire mobs and heard N’zoth whisper “Your every victory serves my will.”
Does anyone remember him saying this back in 8.3? I don’t recall it at all and haven’t been able to find any record of it online yet. Just checking if I’m crazy or they added new lines or something.
I just feel like I would have remembered him saying something like that, but I’m not certain.
Guild Wars 2 communicates story almost perfectly. There's a story journal, there's only ever one story quest active at a time, the order is incredibly clear, and it breadcrumbs you exactly where you need to go before you can see what comes next. WoW really need a system like that, and quite frankly the story quests should act as simple raid attunements you need to see before walking in.
i think it stems from wanting to reuse these characters with complex connections… So it becomes: "Hey you remember that dude we told you was doing some F'd up stuff in Outlands? Well he was actually building a rebel demon army to defend us against the REAL army. Oh and he's the chosen one"
no imagin you can only do LFR and you were forced to wait a month AFTER the raid open to see that. Still doing it.
Anyone find it odd how anduins watch projected a memory which looked to be from ‘light’
Bastion was a heads up on how they'd do things.
For anyone that forgot, the main "bad" guy, Devos. Died in the dungeon long before the story even got there.
It was a warning of what to come, sheer incompetence.
I was doing some Pandaria stuff and noticed that an NPC was talking about "the last titan".
I wanted to remember this and share this lead, but I was stoned and now I don't remember where I was and what I was doing.
It is because there are multiple writers. When everyone in a group can pitch ideas, and people "vote" for what to happen, it can lead to…. different narratives than the obvious/logical ones that fit to the characters/situations
I'd say WoW's writing got much worse after the company started axing what COULD have been in-game content post-Pandaria and either stuffing it in books or abandoning ideas altogether for time-cuts and fast releases. GW2 writing is going down the drain because they're focusing on "faster, shorter, more engaging" patches of content than the original schematic they used with the base game all up through the LWS3 of POF. I've stopped engaging or feeling anything for characters that they puppeteer or sweep under a rug, and when that happens, who cares about a story anymore? And that's not even me touching the surface on how they CHANGE characters to be more modernized or 'appropriated' for modern audiences. Nobody likes unrelatable fiction, especially fiction that projects 'ideal perfection' ("No fighting, let's all be friends here, friendship for everyone, love for everyone").
There is a story "bible" that will have all of the story and the outlines, with descriptions of places, people, things. Probably a HUGE file after 20 years. Thing is, I can see where things can get off, writing by committee is hard. Yes, you have to write the outline, but as writing happens, someone gets a brilliant idea that just has to be used and things get shuffled. As an author of a multi-character ongoing series, I can tell you how messed up outlines get as writing gets done. With the Blizzard team, I tend to think that the people who are in charge of the characters will hear the "voice" and if something gets "said" that is needed, it gets put in. I'm actually amazed the flow of the story isn't more convoluted and confused than it is. I do agree, that little tidbit would have been MUCH better done before the last raid, but that would have needed Anduin to have a chance to drop the compass where they would find it prior to the confrontation with the Jailer and also have time and place to watch it. I don't know how hard that would have been to move and when it was decided.
But Pyro, I am loving what your brain is conjuring. Listening to you, I'm now seeing things in a whole new light. I'm playing through Legion doing a new character and I'm noticing everything in a new light. You're doing a great job of pointing out this stuff and I am loving it.
is everything alright at home?
On the note of the books obfucating the lore and story for a majority of player base, I think having books like the Exploring Azeroth series or Chronicles are fine for fleshing out the world and building up aspects of it that we haven't gone back to in a long while, possibly even planting seeds for future conflicts. But, books like War Crimes, Before the Storm, and Shadows Rising, books that give relevant lore bits that pertain to the story at the point of the book's release (or well before the book's release) honestly need to have their main events relayed to us front and center in the game and not tucked away in some book that only 5% of us will actually read, 25% will watch a youtube video covering it, and the remaining 70% will be lost on what's happening. Like, having the Garrosh trial and the shenanigans that ensued within it as a prepatch scenario would've helped people see how we got from Mists to WoD instead of people slowly realizing how because a couple people read War Crimes and relayed that info to us.
I took a break from gw2 went back and had no idea what was going on and who these new characters are that now my allies…however at least I can go through their story content in a linear fashion and replay them.
FF14 has replay as well and hands down the MSQ. You will know everything about the story in FF14.
When playing WoW I had to question every single time whether or not I’m doing the quests in the correct order that makes sense story wise. The. I stopped playing altogether again. I will probably watch cutscenes somewhere later to catch up before war within.