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I saw a decent amount of comments in the section of the last video talking about the meta. I wanted to clear up my stance on rerolling / FOTM play. My content is here just to be informative to those who are trying to become better.
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TIL what the term META was short for
Pug people want the easiest keys possible. They outsource the knowledge of who to invite to the consensus meta. You would think that this would be news to nobody, but alas 🙂
I think the "downside" is that people tunnel vision on whatever that season's top comp is, and not even what else is top tier that season. As you said, Enhancement Shaman is currently easily second or third best melee, often considered a high A Tier spec – but people will overlook them and wait longer for a DH instead etc.
Personally in my keys (currently 18-20 range) I first look at ilvl and score, and then look at what our group currently lacks for dealing with mechanics in a specific dungeon or affix then I'll take the first thing that ticks those boxes, I'm fully aware that the "god comp" classes are only really important at the highest level of keys.
Something else that is often overlooked, is that the God Comp is often interlocked with each other because X works well with Y which also works well with Z while Q covers the shortcomings of V or whatever – its not uncommon for those classes to fall behind a little bit when taken out of that comp. Then throw in that quite often things need to be played around to be as effective as possible – needing specific sized pulls, or a certain pull cadence or whatever it might be, that is easily achieved in a set group, but can't rely on a PUG tank to do the pulls XYZ class might need to truly shine etc.
Great video Tettles. Tho, one point I think many top-level content creators forget making around this topic is: Lets say you have a VERY thick old tree (+26EB). You're gonna want to use a chainsaw (Havoc) to cut it down. But lets say you instead have a normal sized tree (+17BRH). Your point, Tettles, is "well you don't HAVE to use a chainsaw to cut it down, just bring out your old axe." My point is, well, no logger in their right mind would put aside the chainsaw, unless he simply thinks the axe is more fun and doesn't care about efficiency. Problem is, everyone cares about efficiency in mythic plus, and the people doing 17s can't just "bang on the bongo drums" with shit specs to time it. Just like the top end needs Havoc Aug etc to time 27s, players who are skill capped at +15 also "need" havoc and aug to time those keys, not because it is strictly needed, but because the strength of for example havoc will compensate for the lack of skill and execution of the players. When the top end says "We can't time 27s without X", the same thing is generally happening in most skill brackets below aswell. Most top end players act as if this is strictly an illusion, and while that might be true from the perspective of a top end player, it's not true for everyone. If you play your class at 60% effectiveness in a 15, bringing havoc is always going to be better than not bringing it.
Your video is making things even worse.
I wonder where is tettles based? I’m always intrigued by the view out of his window😊
Its not important.
meta does not mean "most effective tactics available"
Idk I play a full geared aug evoker and got 2.5k+ in the third week (couldn't play much first week). Still takes me 30+ minutes to get into a +20 thats 50/50 good or bad experience while I need higher keys for score. I'd say I play way more than the average player and I would much rather spend my time anywhere else at this point. Trying my luck at mistweaver next after that it's just byebye till next season
Really good take, people tend to wrongly assume things based on what specialization you play and totally agree that all 20's are timeable with all specs. There are much more factors towards such behavior in LFG that pushes into this meta oriented picking.
1. Awarness of other classes (if you play most popular class this patch, there are high chances that your random teammates already played a lot with same spec and know how to play with it)
2. Good players play meta (it is not necesarily true for all cases, but mostly if someone is playing off meta spec, means that they care less about what is strong now or their understanding of the game is not sufficient, again it is not true for all cases and meta players can be really bad at skill as well, but helps to form such opinion)
…? I think it was pretty lame for bellular to randomly taking a jab like that… Unless you are already friends or something. It's just really weird .
I keep getting these kinds of videoception back and forth videos recommended to me. Maybe it's just because i clicked one randomly and now YouTube thinks i like this kind of content. Maybe it's right
But i stopped watching Bellular a while ago. He's so relentlessly negative. It's the same pessimistic vibe continuously, it just feels shitty to watch.
Meta really doesnt matter for most people until you get to very high end. It does get very anyoyying thought with people wanting only meta classes for a 15. Also alot of people reroll meta and have no clue how to play the class. Ill take a talented d tier of a crap s tier.
I have a question regarding key level. What key level/rio would you say any class can run even if its not meta. Is it every dungeons 25? I cant really think of where the breakingpoint is
In farming copious amounts of 19-20 AD for the trinket, the groups where I used drums were just as fast as the groups where I didn't.
BL is such a bait. We have group of like 7 friends rotating where one guy have BL which mean we lot of time dont have it. I woud say we are like average skill people and you can easy time 21 keys without BL
People are just sheep.
Im doing 25 keys steady, and that alone is at a level that most people never reaches.
Ive done 25 steady and without any special comps with
Spriest – WW – Rsham – ProtWarr this season.
And it just shows that all the META talk destroys the game..As you see yourself.
People ask for lust in 7 keys, Augs in 17 keys.
Its only like that because of content creators like you.
You saying " It will be harder to get in" Also has an effect where as those thinking they are top dawgs trying to time a 23-24-25 key. Are actually thinking " Oh i cant do this without GOD COMP" or whatever bullshit name you guys gonna call it.
When in reality..Its ONLY…ONLY for those 0.001% players pushing for a world first key, trying to make it easier for themself..
That should be your DISCLAIMER always. But it never is.. You guys just subtly say " oh its going to be harder to get in"
Yha..again..cause of you guys.
you dont have to tell people to be aware either btw..They are perfectly aware they are not getting into groups cause of content creators like yourself advocating for meta comps.
Smellular
So what im hearing is that you’re telling me to reroll
Good video tettels you explained it perfectly, one thing I would like to add also is that as a community obviously we would prefer to not have such egregious outliers as we did in season 2 leading to the “god comp” however we as a community I think do need to understand as you have said tettels many times there will always be a META in one form or another in varying degrees of severity, this is the just the nature of the beast and a result of an RPG having many multitudes of specs and play styles, an what we need to bare in our minds is that the alternative is homogenisation e.g. less specs, more similar specs, sharing more abilities, more similar damage profiles etc, and at that point for example a warlock just becomes a mage with a purple name plate. An for me I personally would rather have a more diverse and varied class experience as I believe that is what wow is about fundamentally at heart a fantasy RPG, and accept that that this means there will be shifting METAS. as opposed to a streamlined homogeneous more competitive focused design.
The point of 'make your own keys' needs to be reiterated a billion times more. I cannot stress enough how much easier it is to find groups and actually do keys when you host the key. I started this season trying to LFG keys and I got maybe 1 every hour or so (Of requesting that is) but when I started to host my own I was able to crank out about 12 dungeons in a single afternoon. Its like night and day people.
I just came for the salty comments from the one trick ponies. To be clear I think it sucks there’s a meta but it’s a fact of the game so unless you have a team to run with you will have a harder time getting invited to keys.
Telling people to play what they want is a pretty bad advice unless they don't plan to PUG at all. Otherwise youll spent considerably more time in LFG than actually playing m+. Sad but true
I'm torn myself, like yes you do not need a lust in a 7 you can use drums, but also … why? like i could also just look for a lust and have an easier time.
The meta thing can be super annoying and yes you are probably gona time a key with a class thats not meta but most wont even try, thats annoying but the lust thing im 50/50 on, i would rather have a lust, a real one.
Only tengentially related, but the queue process has really started to kill the game for me. Spending 15 or 20 minutes forming a group and getting the key going just for it to sometimes brick 5 minutes in is a terrible experience. Group making eats up sooooo much time (even at lower key levels), especially when compared to just queuing for a league or tft game
I dislike the fact that the community perception of the META is 10x worse than the actual imbalance of the classes for most players. There are certain servers (hello Azralon et al)) that are the worst for this – every season it is a slew of the FOTM players from these servers and 99.9% of the time, they're total garbage. Ironically, these are the most guilty in terms of gatekeeping those meta comps (usually because they require hard carrying due to having no idea how to play the class they just rolled on to). Usually, it means I actively avoid inviting meta classes with lower IO to any key below a 20 – usually FOTM re-rollers with zero clue how to play. Invite the feral, survival, etc with solid, IO from this season and the last.
It's a self fulfilling prophecy. You make videos telling people the meta matters. People think meta matters. People apply your meta to their gameplay.
If you play in a closed group, it doesn't matter to you.
Thanks for fucking LFG.
the problem are the casual player base, that just wanna run 20 keys, they are playing just meta classes, and if they dont play meta classes, they just accept meta classes on their keys
If you as influencers, do content for off meta specs, they will accept other classes/specs
Thanks for explaining what "meta" actually stands for. I saw the word thrown around all the time, and when contextualizing it I realized it meant something along the lines of "the shit that works the best", but I didn't know why it was called "meta". I have been wondering for the last 3 or 4 years lmao. Thanks again! 🤣
"+7 Lust and tank", It's a joke, no tank can lust
the problem I clearly see, people confidently managing to say: "I have 2k rating I'm clearly ready to play 18 and above." Everybody is able to climb, but it's hard to jump keylevels. I've never seen somebody truly expecting to get picked for a 26 if they didn't timed it 25.
the problem is that content creators don't understand why people get frustrated by these "meta defining" videos is that there are a lot of people in wow who make their parties in lfg and only accept meta classes even when it's not necessary (like in the lower lvl keys) and this is all because the funny man on youtube said so, so it must be true!
it's completely understandable to want to stick to the meta when you're doing mid 20s keys but it's a challenge to get into a party even at the 15 range, like bruh you legit don't need to stick to the meta at M+15…
Here's an interesting question.
Would WoW be better if the classes were homogenized? Where the differences were cosmetic or themed vice mechanical.
Give every class a spell interrupt on the same cooldown; give each dps class a bloodlust; give every healer a cure/cleanse/decurse;
Would simply changing the theme but making each class have equivalent abilities allow the developers to focus on challenging content and give players greater agency so they could play the class they want with the only variation being the damage mechanic; affliction dotting; rogues backstabbing; warriors whirlwinding; etc. improve the game?
Balance Druid here. Reached 3.2k with faily good access to pugging keys in the first 4 weeks but all of a sudden, the meta has landed and I haven't been able to get into a push key the entire week. Queued for literally 14 hours this week without an invite. With Augs so key with tank and healer, Blizz really needs to raise the group number to 6 and to allow for you to queue more than 5 keys at a time. Why not also give players an 'all time' M+ score on a character. I've been 3k+ on every season yet that experience is lost with each season
The meta is only as important as it is to you. And sadly it's important to many, but an indoctrination nonetheless. There is no real pressure to follow these stats, the pressure is just from peers- it's more of a social study. And no matter how many times you rhetorically ask "right?" doesn't make the subject anymore objective.
To be honest the fact you and all the people like you don’t point out the issue is the horrid imbalance baffles me. It is blizzards fault.
There will always be a meta yes but there doesn’t always need to be a handful of things that are egregiously imbalanced and it’s been worse given the Godcomp and their inability to balance is even more on the forefront of discussion due to that.
Light a fire under blizzards asses because the issue is you are blaming the community and not incompetence of the balance team, we are consumers it is an mmo.
We can expect more out of our games as a service, and the sub they get.
But all your points are about related to community perception
I don’t know how ”meta” came to be definied as an abbreviation for ”most effective tactic available”. Meta comes from the Greek prefix and preposition meta, which means “after” or “beyond.” When combined with words in English, meta- often signifies “change” or “alteration” as in the words metamorphic or metabolic
I get insta vites to everything on my mw monk and havoc dh even though my havoc is low io my mw is highly geared and my blood dk is max geared and struggles to get invites the meta is real and people pick it on priority
But why create metas in the first place, why has blizzard not been able to balance their specs in nearly 20 years. Why have some specs been dumpster fire nearly since their inception. Why do I have to work twice as hard to find a group for content that is easy even for trash specs. I will never understand how Blizzard does it every seasons so specs at the top are so far apart from the ones at the bottom. I have played so many mmos and not one of them other than WoW creates a gap so wide between specs where you get rejected if you play non meta. Blizzard's community have been telling them for years how to fix their specs that don't work and what do they do every season, they just bandaid the class with +% damage like it's gonna fix everything. I have no problem with some comps being better than others but the gap between good and bad in WoW is way too big
Great video
sorry brother but forced to reroll is not the case for people like you that got premades etc. i dont know if you have any idea how hard it is to get invited with an off-meta spec on a pug. you ARE in a way forced to reroll
What blizzard really needs is to add Mythic+ to the Group finder. At least up to +20. Yes they would have to build some intelligence into it (item level at least, rating) but it should be eminently doable. There is no reason people should have to use premades for 20 and under. And get rid of key depletion.
Hi Tettles, good video I just have a huge nitpick about smth small which nonetheless makes me mald.
Meta unequivocally, DOES NOT mean "most efficient tactic available". I don't know who came up with this unbelievably dumb backronym, but it's utterly wrong and I can't help but correct it. Meta is from Greek and means "after", and when we say meta in a video game context it's short for *metagame*, which is an old term that predates video games, and is the "game about the game" you're playing by analyzing statistics, historical tactics and data that formulates superior, winning strategies.
I know this is a ridiculous quibble on an otherwise cool video that shouldn't be necessary because people are idiots, but I couldn't help myself! Hope you keep up the good work.
Them looking for a tank with lust for a +7 might actually be one of the funniest things i've seen in a while
You lost all credibility the first minute when you said meta is an acronym…
Kinda hard to watch a video about meta when you have no grasp on what the term even means to be honest
I feel like this season has been good so far in not needing a set meta comp to do keys. Most of the tanks feel viable and you have about 4-5 dps classes that all do good AOE dps. I've done +26s with all kinds of random comps. Last season 90% of the keys were just the god comp.
Meta is important to push, if you just wanna chill & get you +20 for teleportation, you don't need any meta every classes can do the job.
The only thing if you don't play meta is to take a group that have synergie, in therms of cuts, in therms of CC, in therms of off-healing ect ect… but ofc if you don't play the meta you' can't push high as a meta group
so yeah, meta is important, for people who wants to push as far as they can, not for casual ppl that just want to enjoy the game without brainstorming for a key
haha you live off the blue line in Chicago. Nice
I'm telling my whole guild that Tettles told me to reroll to a meta spec.