They had a home run with shuffle and just fumbled it after deflating seasons one after another dumb dumb at blizz I unsubbed after I hit duelist in the second week then was hardstuck at duelist the entire season.
Wow pvp been dying since mop honestly. It's what I played wow for and don't get me wrong raids are fun and all but some time you just wanna skill cap others 🤷♂️ I miss the good old days ngl.
Shocking when they throw out all the content that might entice people to pvp gets thrown out every time a season ends since unlike mythic raiding you can never go back and get older sets or mounts. Throw in a nice chunk of toxicity from just the fact any pvp breeds it. And then remember unless your class is a winner in the balancing lottery you have to spend hours releveling and regearing or have a much worse time than any fotm reroller.
They just need to go all in on BGs. Give us more options for how we want to PVP. Let us queue for single modes and still get benefits. I would queue AV all day if I were given that option – I can't stand having to sit through an Ashrand or Wintergrasp when I just want to do AV. Epic BGs are the major selling point of pvp to me. You can't get that experience in any other game. Arena just stresses me and everyone I know out. Looking forward to solo queue for RBGs in War Within. Honestly, they should just remove ratings, I've never played for that until you needed it to get better gear. I always just played for fun and that kind of sucked the fun out of it.
The way I see it, if your game isn't a dedicated PVP game, it's very easy to neglect PVP and cause it to die and it'll be nearly impossible to get it to recover.
I think rated Blitz will save WoW pvp, and will be the future of rated pvp in this game. Giving people who don't normally play rated pvp a low-stakes environment to farm vicious saddles and maybe make elite set pushes will increase pvp participation.
WoW PvP should been all about rated BGs, not arena. As long as they want to push arena as the prime pvp mode, nothing will change. That on top of an extremely bloated game, with way too many abilites and modifiers. You need to know like 400 abilities across all the different classes. No wonder new people run screaming away from this.
no one wants to pvp the same ancient maps. blizzard needs to stop thinking they need a new mode for a new map. there should be like 10 ctf maps, 10 ab style maps and so on at this point
Pvp is only about loot,transmog,mounts,nothing else,warmode is just for bonus,then wm off,uninterested in pvp fun anymore,Bfa was the best pvp expansion especially warmode,after that i lost interest.Maybe there are still people having fun in pvp,i have lost completely interests except gear and mounts,also depends how good they are.Mythic plus is like Casino Royale and everyone plays there and is ok,better then pvp.
leveling bgs are shit because of level syncing and twinking, max level bgs are shit because everyone is made of paper untill they have a higher ilvl. they need to get rid of ilvl, and stop the level syncing.
Probs are that if youre a mid Player 1,2-1,6 (most are!) You get nothing out of it 1 mount and a half transmog…they wait years for a bg ..alone Blitz take 1 year 2 make it happen…we need SOME new bgs..overhaul the rating System and add a battle Pass like System with rewards! And stop give them damn Raid recolours..BAD ASS transmogs as rewards..no damn hats with flowers!
WOW PVP is essentially competing with MOBAs, both battlegrounds and Arenas just can't compete with DOTA or league.
MMOPVP is a completely different beast, and the issue with the way WOW minigamed the PVP in WOW and ignored WPVP until straight up removing it with warmode deleting PVP servers, as well as the fact they haven't done any PVP zone style content since cataclysm.
The issue with PVP in arenas and BGs is that you're sitting there getting farmed by people for hundreds of hours until you finally get your PVP gear at which point you can actually compete, this was especially bad during the era of PVP stats like Resilience and the absolute garbage that was PVP Power in MOP (a pure win more stat), then you have issues where you try to make it a pure skill based experience by making gear a non-factor (legion) and people still hate it because now they're playing a MOBA with no power progression.
Then of course you have the issue with how WOW is designed, all the interaction players used to have has been stripped out and replaced with extra action buttons and gimmicky debuff/stacking mechanics in raids, and because base kits of classes have been so stripped down they have to reintroduce interaction in the form of PVP talents, which are incredibly janky and unintuitive because you're not using them regularly, only in PVP scenarios and only if you remember they exist, so unless you're a hardcore arena nerd who understand these abilities and when and where to use them, your character just doesn't feel good in PVP, and don't get me started on how bad the builder spender class design built around 2-3 minute cooldown intervals during boss fights completely devolves in PVP where some classes are just screwed.
If WOW wants a thriving PVP community again, it can't keep trying to force protoMOBAs where people pretend skill exists when really its gear and comp RNG. Instead they need to make PVP an MMO experience again, and the way to do that is to expand on war mode and make it something more than a 10% exp boost for horde players. Exclusive crafting materials that drops on death for exclusive WPVP gear with interesting and cool mechanics that breaks the game, but in a sandbox environment that is warmode, sprinkle in some conquest/siege mechanics, like capturing towns to give you closer flight points/resource depositing spots and you might actually have an MMO PVP system again. And you can see that the dynamics of player hunter while gathering loot can be fun simply by how people have been enjoying plunderstorm, the problem with plunderstorm is that its kind of just a lame fortnite minigame that is completely divorced from the core gameplay of WOW.
But keep trying to force Arena just isn't going to go anywhere, because Arena is fundamentally imbalanced at its core, and RBGs aren't much better, especially with the game in the state it is currently queue times are atrocious, and they need to think about moving away form queue based content in the first place and return to the MMO Sandbox form where MMO PVP thrives.
Dying you say that's generous it's been Dead since WOD and I did Arena's from TBC to WOD I wouldn't like to guess how much of the player base did PVP in TBC and WOTLK but it was a lot once Cata hit I would guess at a high it was 10% of the player base if that and it's been dropping ever since to where Blizz needs to add in Bots just so people can play. PVE was always the primary content PVP was the mini game if you were bored.
Thank you for saying it!!! Yes, its PvP – but it's not WoW PvP – not even close. I don't particularly like it, in fact I haven't played a SINGLE game – but I (contrary to many) genuinely do see Plunderstorm as an overall plus for the game. You can't reasonably say it's bad when clearly a lot of people have enjoyed it. It just shouldn't be conflated with or remove resources from actual WoW PvP.
On actual PvP: I know some people don't enjoy it, but I genuinely believe Solo Shuffle has introduced more people to arenas and will turn out to be a net positive for the PvP scene. Battleground Blitz has also been pretty interesting so I really a hope a rated solo BG mode will actually be introduced. Personally, I don't mind Blizz carry out these experiments, hell, Blizz can even carry on putting more attention on PvE – but please don't let "traditional" PvP die and fall into obscurity! I say "traditional" because I also don't want to see Arenas and BG's be upended or otherwise transformed just for the sake of more players. Keep what you have, and if necessary experiment around and introduce new things for other people to enjoy without nullifying what came before.
We all know WoW is primarily PvE now, and I think a lot of us have come to terms with that and would be relatively ok with it IF only PvP was given some actual TLC instead of being left to rot in a box at the back of the basement. Nothing hits like WoW PvP.
you guys should invite a pvp-focused content creator to come talk with you about the issues, I feel like you guys were very close to encapsulating it but missed some important things that you only really experience by doing it (for example healer MMR issues where you can't climb because you're only competing against the other healer) – I vote supatease
They've been experimenting for years on PvP. Too bad the people who are coming up with ideas have no experience with PvP and think that if what they are doing has failed in the past, they should keep trying to do more of the same and expect different results.
Half of players used to queue for bgs during wrath. If they weren't so set on rewarding people with great gear with easy wins for farming noobs with their premades they might actually see why there is no future growth potential.
Search engines sucking Thralls balls is a combination of there being no search engines online (there are only pitch engines nowadays) and SEO (Search Engine Optimization, people being payed to cheat, manipulate and otherwise fuck with them) ruining them.
DF S1 was stupidly great. Balance patches left and right, highly inflated MMR, no tier set for half a season, over-populated WPVP quests with that Thaldraszus spot where everyone would fight at the revive, the over-populated strife farm, bounties popping left and right (hell, that one time I had a bounty on my head while on top of a spire at the waking shores). Now you get lucky if you find anyone to kill during a war supply chest drop while complaining about queue times and LFGs
For me PVP in WOW is not existing. If I want to play some PVP i run Apex Legends, or if I would have it more complex i would pick LOL or Dota2(long time I didn't play them). On PVE I'm not pushing +++25, but have some +20 on both my two characters.
I used to only pvp, and now I only pve in WoW. Queue times are terrible and the general state of the experience is just… not great. The skill gap between those who are established and new or even mid tier players is so vast that it's virtually unapproachable. And that's before talking about how intrusive the amount of CC is, needing to know every single class and spec and have so much situational awareness of all 6 people having way too many buffs etc to keep track of at any given second, the macros and things that are legal to be fair, but are basically uncounterable (I'm thinking of for example a rogue macro that was recently highlighted that let them instantly blink on a target, stun/kick and instantly blink back with 1 button press). And THEN even if you're willing to persevere beyond all that, their rating system and MMR and skill based match making is completely fucked atm, and the rewards are dog water and offer little to nothing for anyone who isn't going for, or unable to achieve, gladiator. Compound that with stagnation, no new maps, boosting, etc, and yeah… PVP is rightfully dead.
I think there's something to be said about the speed of combat in WoW now, and how that has affected PvP and newcomers to it. PvP, in general, is a lot more accesible in most forms of classic due to the slower pace and more basic animations, I feel.
They had a home run with shuffle and just fumbled it after deflating seasons one after another dumb dumb at blizz I unsubbed after I hit duelist in the second week then was hardstuck at duelist the entire season.
Wow pvp been dying since mop honestly. It's what I played wow for and don't get me wrong raids are fun and all but some time you just wanna skill cap others 🤷♂️ I miss the good old days ngl.
solo shuffle and battleground blitz are pretty solid fundations to rebuild PvP on
Shocking when they throw out all the content that might entice people to pvp gets thrown out every time a season ends since unlike mythic raiding you can never go back and get older sets or mounts. Throw in a nice chunk of toxicity from just the fact any pvp breeds it. And then remember unless your class is a winner in the balancing lottery you have to spend hours releveling and regearing or have a much worse time than any fotm reroller.
All of WoW is pvp. Directly or indirectly, but pvp nonetheless.
They just need to go all in on BGs. Give us more options for how we want to PVP. Let us queue for single modes and still get benefits. I would queue AV all day if I were given that option – I can't stand having to sit through an Ashrand or Wintergrasp when I just want to do AV. Epic BGs are the major selling point of pvp to me. You can't get that experience in any other game. Arena just stresses me and everyone I know out. Looking forward to solo queue for RBGs in War Within. Honestly, they should just remove ratings, I've never played for that until you needed it to get better gear. I always just played for fun and that kind of sucked the fun out of it.
wow is ded gam
The way I see it, if your game isn't a dedicated PVP game, it's very easy to neglect PVP and cause it to die and it'll be nearly impossible to get it to recover.
I think rated Blitz will save WoW pvp, and will be the future of rated pvp in this game. Giving people who don't normally play rated pvp a low-stakes environment to farm vicious saddles and maybe make elite set pushes will increase pvp participation.
WoW PvP should been all about rated BGs, not arena. As long as they want to push arena as the prime pvp mode, nothing will change. That on top of an extremely bloated game, with way too many abilites and modifiers. You need to know like 400 abilities across all the different classes. No wonder new people run screaming away from this.
no one wants to pvp the same ancient maps. blizzard needs to stop thinking they need a new mode for a new map. there should be like 10 ctf maps, 10 ab style maps and so on at this point
PVP tried to become an esport.. so no wonder it got screwed
Pvp is only about loot,transmog,mounts,nothing else,warmode is just for bonus,then wm off,uninterested in pvp fun anymore,Bfa was the best pvp expansion especially warmode,after that i lost interest.Maybe there are still people having fun in pvp,i have lost completely interests except gear and mounts,also depends how good they are.Mythic plus is like Casino Royale and everyone plays there and is ok,better then pvp.
leveling bgs are shit because of level syncing and twinking, max level bgs are shit because everyone is made of paper untill they have a higher ilvl. they need to get rid of ilvl, and stop the level syncing.
Probs are that if youre a mid Player 1,2-1,6 (most are!) You get nothing out of it 1 mount and a half transmog…they wait years for a bg ..alone Blitz take 1 year 2 make it happen…we need SOME new bgs..overhaul the rating System and add a battle Pass like System with rewards! And stop give them damn Raid recolours..BAD ASS transmogs as rewards..no damn hats with flowers!
Blizzard only cares about Mythic Raiding and keeping player engagement up with FOMO BS.
WOW PVP is essentially competing with MOBAs, both battlegrounds and Arenas just can't compete with DOTA or league.
MMOPVP is a completely different beast, and the issue with the way WOW minigamed the PVP in WOW and ignored WPVP until straight up removing it with warmode deleting PVP servers, as well as the fact they haven't done any PVP zone style content since cataclysm.
The issue with PVP in arenas and BGs is that you're sitting there getting farmed by people for hundreds of hours until you finally get your PVP gear at which point you can actually compete, this was especially bad during the era of PVP stats like Resilience and the absolute garbage that was PVP Power in MOP (a pure win more stat), then you have issues where you try to make it a pure skill based experience by making gear a non-factor (legion) and people still hate it because now they're playing a MOBA with no power progression.
Then of course you have the issue with how WOW is designed, all the interaction players used to have has been stripped out and replaced with extra action buttons and gimmicky debuff/stacking mechanics in raids, and because base kits of classes have been so stripped down they have to reintroduce interaction in the form of PVP talents, which are incredibly janky and unintuitive because you're not using them regularly, only in PVP scenarios and only if you remember they exist, so unless you're a hardcore arena nerd who understand these abilities and when and where to use them, your character just doesn't feel good in PVP, and don't get me started on how bad the builder spender class design built around 2-3 minute cooldown intervals during boss fights completely devolves in PVP where some classes are just screwed.
If WOW wants a thriving PVP community again, it can't keep trying to force protoMOBAs where people pretend skill exists when really its gear and comp RNG. Instead they need to make PVP an MMO experience again, and the way to do that is to expand on war mode and make it something more than a 10% exp boost for horde players. Exclusive crafting materials that drops on death for exclusive WPVP gear with interesting and cool mechanics that breaks the game, but in a sandbox environment that is warmode, sprinkle in some conquest/siege mechanics, like capturing towns to give you closer flight points/resource depositing spots and you might actually have an MMO PVP system again. And you can see that the dynamics of player hunter while gathering loot can be fun simply by how people have been enjoying plunderstorm, the problem with plunderstorm is that its kind of just a lame fortnite minigame that is completely divorced from the core gameplay of WOW.
But keep trying to force Arena just isn't going to go anywhere, because Arena is fundamentally imbalanced at its core, and RBGs aren't much better, especially with the game in the state it is currently queue times are atrocious, and they need to think about moving away form queue based content in the first place and return to the MMO Sandbox form where MMO PVP thrives.
Blizzard hates pvpers
Dying you say that's generous it's been Dead since WOD and I did Arena's from TBC to WOD I wouldn't like to guess how much of the player base did PVP in TBC and WOTLK but it was a lot once Cata hit I would guess at a high it was 10% of the player base if that and it's been dropping ever since to where Blizz needs to add in Bots just so people can play. PVE was always the primary content PVP was the mini game if you were bored.
You guys still play this game….
LOL😂
Thank you for saying it!!! Yes, its PvP – but it's not WoW PvP – not even close. I don't particularly like it, in fact I haven't played a SINGLE game – but I (contrary to many) genuinely do see Plunderstorm as an overall plus for the game. You can't reasonably say it's bad when clearly a lot of people have enjoyed it. It just shouldn't be conflated with or remove resources from actual WoW PvP.
On actual PvP: I know some people don't enjoy it, but I genuinely believe Solo Shuffle has introduced more people to arenas and will turn out to be a net positive for the PvP scene. Battleground Blitz has also been pretty interesting so I really a hope a rated solo BG mode will actually be introduced. Personally, I don't mind Blizz carry out these experiments, hell, Blizz can even carry on putting more attention on PvE – but please don't let "traditional" PvP die and fall into obscurity! I say "traditional" because I also don't want to see Arenas and BG's be upended or otherwise transformed just for the sake of more players. Keep what you have, and if necessary experiment around and introduce new things for other people to enjoy without nullifying what came before.
We all know WoW is primarily PvE now, and I think a lot of us have come to terms with that and would be relatively ok with it IF only PvP was given some actual TLC instead of being left to rot in a box at the back of the basement. Nothing hits like WoW PvP.
you guys should invite a pvp-focused content creator to come talk with you about the issues, I feel like you guys were very close to encapsulating it but missed some important things that you only really experience by doing it (for example healer MMR issues where you can't climb because you're only competing against the other healer) – I vote supatease
They've been experimenting for years on PvP. Too bad the people who are coming up with ideas have no experience with PvP and think that if what they are doing has failed in the past, they should keep trying to do more of the same and expect different results.
Half of players used to queue for bgs during wrath. If they weren't so set on rewarding people with great gear with easy wins for farming noobs with their premades they might actually see why there is no future growth potential.
Search engines sucking Thralls balls is a combination of there being no search engines online (there are only pitch engines nowadays) and SEO (Search Engine Optimization, people being payed to cheat, manipulate and otherwise fuck with them) ruining them.
I don't even play wow and I know pvp is beyond dead 😂
DF S1 was stupidly great. Balance patches left and right, highly inflated MMR, no tier set for half a season, over-populated WPVP quests with that Thaldraszus spot where everyone would fight at the revive, the over-populated strife farm, bounties popping left and right (hell, that one time I had a bounty on my head while on top of a spire at the waking shores). Now you get lucky if you find anyone to kill during a war supply chest drop while complaining about queue times and LFGs
Been dead since wod
Why would any plays pvp for no rewards. People only play mmo for player power gain.
When was the last time PvP got new content (Arenas, BGs or a true new game mode)?
Good
For me PVP in WOW is not existing. If I want to play some PVP i run Apex Legends, or if I would have it more complex i would pick LOL or Dota2(long time I didn't play them). On PVE I'm not pushing +++25, but have some +20 on both my two characters.
M+ is learnable PVP is straight up impossible 😅 nobody cares about mythic raiding but the sweats. Heroic raiding and M+ is where it is at in WOW atm
I used to only pvp, and now I only pve in WoW. Queue times are terrible and the general state of the experience is just… not great. The skill gap between those who are established and new or even mid tier players is so vast that it's virtually unapproachable. And that's before talking about how intrusive the amount of CC is, needing to know every single class and spec and have so much situational awareness of all 6 people having way too many buffs etc to keep track of at any given second, the macros and things that are legal to be fair, but are basically uncounterable (I'm thinking of for example a rogue macro that was recently highlighted that let them instantly blink on a target, stun/kick and instantly blink back with 1 button press). And THEN even if you're willing to persevere beyond all that, their rating system and MMR and skill based match making is completely fucked atm, and the rewards are dog water and offer little to nothing for anyone who isn't going for, or unable to achieve, gladiator. Compound that with stagnation, no new maps, boosting, etc, and yeah… PVP is rightfully dead.
I think there's something to be said about the speed of combat in WoW now, and how that has affected PvP and newcomers to it. PvP, in general, is a lot more accesible in most forms of classic due to the slower pace and more basic animations, I feel.
I haven’t raided once or done a single mythic all xp. PvP everyday baby